This is brilliant. So well written and so personal. Disturbing, too.
I'm curious about how your title, "Love in the Time of Stripping" relates to these words of yours: "Most disturbing to me some nights is the knowledge of how often I have—as a people-pleasing femme socialized to contort myself for the comfort of others—offered myself up in this way without any expectation of reciprocity, much less return." Do you think heterosexual love is lost to you? (I'm not saying you're looking, either), and if so, do you think stripping played any causal role in that? or was it purely the insights you got from stripping? (If you don't mind my asking.)
Thank you so much for engaging my work, Jack! I think I address this question sideways in my brief discussion of uncomfortable truths, but I am also unsure of the precise temporal or experiential distinction you’re making between causality and discernment. Could you please rephrase the question so that I may respond more directly?
Thanks for responding, and maybe you did. You are talking about this passage and the following words about liking older men? "Another uncomfortable truth about stripping is that sometimes fake flirting with customers feels a little like actual dating used to feel like with men. Being hyperaware of the artificial layers of romance mythology, the validation that being desired can bestow and what it can destroy, makes it harder to date now, not to mention almost logistically impossible..."
I didn't assume that meant you were talking about it being harder to date men; I would think it meant being harder to date anybody, and in any case love is so much more complex than just dating. Can you forgive a guy for his role in the male gaze that transfixes you every night? (okay, that's maybe a little dramatic a way of putting it, but I'd think any time a guy admires your looks you'd have to wonder). And all of this comes on top of your previous experience as a woman. The similarities between before and now must be discouraging. Is it possible to get past that?
To be clear I don’t like older men per se, I just find points of connection with them if they are of a certain era LOL. And while I’ve had experiences with women at strip clubs, the majority of my observations are about men I encounter as connected to broader structures of feeling and power. So yes, I mean that dating men specifically has become harder since stripping for emotional and logistical reasons, although the hopeless romantic in me says it’s not impossible. In the context of the club I am consenting to sexual objectification so as long as I am being compensated for it I don’t have an issue. In other words it is not about the male gaze but the deeper, more subtle ways men act out their own psychic wounds at the club.
Thanks for the response. I find this fascinating: "In the context of the club I am consenting to sexual objectification so as long as I am being compensated for it I don’t have an issue. In other words it is not about the male gaze but the deeper, more subtle ways men act out their own psychic wounds at the club."
However, in the first place I don't want to impose on your time, but more than that I am also sensitive to the fact that my asking such personal questions may begin to approximate the stage for you, and I don't want to do that to you. So perhaps I'll just suggest that would be a good topic for you at some point and offer either to shut up or ask you questions, whichever would suit you.
I'll repeat that I loved your article, and I appreciate the time you've shared with me. I admire your work here.
I appreciate your questions because 1) I feel they are coming from a genuine place, although of course the writer in me is curious to know more specifics about that place and your own experiences (or not) w/the club; 2) I’m continuing to write about this topic in my current post in progress; and 3) I love to know what is striking the interest and curiosity of readers. So thank you!
I've been to strip clubs a grand total of twice. :) Once because my younger brother (lawyer) was representing one of the dancers and needed to stop by, and the other time for some reason unknown (but very much needing an explanation!) because of my older brother. Mostly I didn't like them because it seemed exploitative, and I don't like that happening to anybody. The second time, however, there was an incredible stripper who was so athletic she transcended the commercial feeling (although of course she was showered with money), and there were pole dancers, whom I also admire.
I have also dated a former stripper - probably more than one, but one I knew about - so I retain some interest in their experiences on that basis I guess. And of course you write so vividly I feel like I've been there with you. And finally, I'm friends with an erotica writer/key-holder (if you're familiar with the chastity kink) who is collaborating with me on a novel I'm writing that includes that kink.
So there's a little grist for your mill to repay you for your kindness!
Incredible writing, friend. And relatable as always!!
Thank you very much, Raechel, that means a lot to me 🩷🤍 and I feel so connected to you through our writings here 💕
This is brilliant. So well written and so personal. Disturbing, too.
I'm curious about how your title, "Love in the Time of Stripping" relates to these words of yours: "Most disturbing to me some nights is the knowledge of how often I have—as a people-pleasing femme socialized to contort myself for the comfort of others—offered myself up in this way without any expectation of reciprocity, much less return." Do you think heterosexual love is lost to you? (I'm not saying you're looking, either), and if so, do you think stripping played any causal role in that? or was it purely the insights you got from stripping? (If you don't mind my asking.)
Thank you so much for engaging my work, Jack! I think I address this question sideways in my brief discussion of uncomfortable truths, but I am also unsure of the precise temporal or experiential distinction you’re making between causality and discernment. Could you please rephrase the question so that I may respond more directly?
Thanks for responding, and maybe you did. You are talking about this passage and the following words about liking older men? "Another uncomfortable truth about stripping is that sometimes fake flirting with customers feels a little like actual dating used to feel like with men. Being hyperaware of the artificial layers of romance mythology, the validation that being desired can bestow and what it can destroy, makes it harder to date now, not to mention almost logistically impossible..."
I didn't assume that meant you were talking about it being harder to date men; I would think it meant being harder to date anybody, and in any case love is so much more complex than just dating. Can you forgive a guy for his role in the male gaze that transfixes you every night? (okay, that's maybe a little dramatic a way of putting it, but I'd think any time a guy admires your looks you'd have to wonder). And all of this comes on top of your previous experience as a woman. The similarities between before and now must be discouraging. Is it possible to get past that?
To be clear I don’t like older men per se, I just find points of connection with them if they are of a certain era LOL. And while I’ve had experiences with women at strip clubs, the majority of my observations are about men I encounter as connected to broader structures of feeling and power. So yes, I mean that dating men specifically has become harder since stripping for emotional and logistical reasons, although the hopeless romantic in me says it’s not impossible. In the context of the club I am consenting to sexual objectification so as long as I am being compensated for it I don’t have an issue. In other words it is not about the male gaze but the deeper, more subtle ways men act out their own psychic wounds at the club.
Thanks for the response. I find this fascinating: "In the context of the club I am consenting to sexual objectification so as long as I am being compensated for it I don’t have an issue. In other words it is not about the male gaze but the deeper, more subtle ways men act out their own psychic wounds at the club."
However, in the first place I don't want to impose on your time, but more than that I am also sensitive to the fact that my asking such personal questions may begin to approximate the stage for you, and I don't want to do that to you. So perhaps I'll just suggest that would be a good topic for you at some point and offer either to shut up or ask you questions, whichever would suit you.
I'll repeat that I loved your article, and I appreciate the time you've shared with me. I admire your work here.
I appreciate your questions because 1) I feel they are coming from a genuine place, although of course the writer in me is curious to know more specifics about that place and your own experiences (or not) w/the club; 2) I’m continuing to write about this topic in my current post in progress; and 3) I love to know what is striking the interest and curiosity of readers. So thank you!
I've been to strip clubs a grand total of twice. :) Once because my younger brother (lawyer) was representing one of the dancers and needed to stop by, and the other time for some reason unknown (but very much needing an explanation!) because of my older brother. Mostly I didn't like them because it seemed exploitative, and I don't like that happening to anybody. The second time, however, there was an incredible stripper who was so athletic she transcended the commercial feeling (although of course she was showered with money), and there were pole dancers, whom I also admire.
I have also dated a former stripper - probably more than one, but one I knew about - so I retain some interest in their experiences on that basis I guess. And of course you write so vividly I feel like I've been there with you. And finally, I'm friends with an erotica writer/key-holder (if you're familiar with the chastity kink) who is collaborating with me on a novel I'm writing that includes that kink.
So there's a little grist for your mill to repay you for your kindness!